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Global Warming Debate - Some information

By Damien Handslip of Flag Diesel

Possibly previously mentioned was the fact that I kept temperature records for my beloved South of France.

I did a bit of additional work on the data this week to determine if there was any detectable average temperature change from 2002 to this year, year on year.

The answer was each of these years varied from the other in a sort of sinus rhythm, but 2002 average temperatures were the same as this year and 2003 the same as 2005 and 2004 the same as 2006 etc.

What that tells me is that either I have been gathering the wrong data (From Meteo) or that Meteo is consistently wrong. I think not on both counts.

If my data sources are good then is my database analysis suspect? Answer no; Crystal Reports is a well respected analysis tool.

That leaves us with one inescapable fact. The professional scientists have been massaging the figures and selling it to our governments. Possibly to keep them in employment and on the world stage.

Global warming (cooling) has been going on since the formation of the earth. Our early ancestors ran around in appalling conditions during an ice age. This ice age went away without help from greenhouse gases and atmospheric pollutants. There is no way they were driving around in gas guzzlers and producing oodles of CO2.

Let's get real and send these scientists back to their test tubes, climate measurement instruments and so on.
I would be happy to show them how it's done, measured and analysed.

My own weather instruments may not be big and good looking but they do get my (local) weather right most of the time.

The scientists will probably mock me for my naivety, but amateurs have been right a lot of the time.

The subject is now open for sensible debate. All those chaps and chapesses can come back from Copenhagen and get their scientists doing proper science, instead of climbing on the bandwagon of whatever is in vogue.

Contributor's Note

I have a thick skin (not!) so be gentle with me.
The fact that there is global warming is not the issue. It is the cause of it. We have had ice-ages and the opposite through history without the hand of man being involved, why suddenly do we round on ourselves and condemn industry for being the problem? There is enough stored frozen methane in the depths of the ocean to kill us all if it melts in sufficient quantity.
We cannot cure every ailment of this earth, it will adjust itself regardless of whether we like the result. Earth may kill us all off and then we don't need to worry do we?
I have no confidence in the doomsayers, they are there for their own agrandisement and nobody else, hence the dozens of limos at the Copenhagen Conference.
Say what you will, I have a point.

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frederick Dec 10, 2009 18:40

You are on the right track. Locally there was a news report that stated some of the weather data collection points had flaws. Example, a sensor located in an environment that stayed heated due to it's close proximity to an outside commercial air conditioning unit.

I have 3 little weather stations at home by Oregon Scientific. I have had the oldest since 1995, bought in Atlanta, GA.
They give me my local weather far better than any Met Office presentation on TV or Radio. The American forecasts cover such a wide area that they must be useless.
I have been a hang-glider and microlite pilot and got my fixed wing licence in the US. In the run up to these activities I had to learn a lot about the weather, so I can pick up on obvious errors by the forecasters and doomsayers.
Sometimes on Discovery Channel you see certain evidence was gathered for these climate change theories.
In one I saw this guy, screw a coresampler into a tree, take a sample and move on to the next acre! Is that good science?
I could go on all day on this. When I see my Prime Minister waffling away and strutting his stuff amongst equally funny people I feel ashamed. Does he really think he is going to shape history. He should just come home and resign after giving our troops some decent equipment to fight the fight in Afghanistan, then come home and get in the queue for jobs.
Sorry about the diatribe, but having lived through WWII and to 69 years, I feel I have earned the right to have a moan now and again.

Thanks for your comment, it was very heartening.

Oh dear, yet another simplistic failure to understand the science, coupled with a monumental arrogance that you know better than thousands of highly qualified scientists in dozens of disciplines all around the planet. No, you don't have a point, other than that you are incapable of understanding the science of climate change. Note that word 'climate', it's not the 'weather', the two are different. Please try to find a few facts before displaying your lack of understanding and ignorance. This site may help you understand: http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php. Why should anyone be gentle with you when you post such crass nonsense as this backed up by nothing whatsoever.
Despite your feeble measurements over a very short period, 2009 was the hottest year on record, and that includes ALL records around the planet. Yes, the planet will make us extinct one day, especially if we don't radically change our ways. Your attitude is pure selfishness; 'why should I change my lifestyle, it won't affect me anyway'. I'd like to think my grandchildren have a future. You clearly get your insulting attitude that all these thousands of reputable scientists are crooks and liars to benefit themselves, from the loony, right-wing American denialists [many of whom also deny evolution, though in their case I'd make an exception, they appear remarkably unevolved to me. Your age is no excuse, it happens to be the same as mine. I have made sure to be informed by facts. Go read that website, you will find answers to every lame excuse dreamed up to deny what we have done and are continuing to do.

Foolonthehill May 31, 2010 14:22

Conflating scientists and politicians weakens your argument further; the limos were for politicians, the scientists are all working for salaries, in most cases considerably less than what diesel salesmen earn. This illustrates your method of point scoring though. Do you also believe scoientists involved in developing new drug cures for human diseases are bent and falsifying their data to make a buck? Better stay away from doctors or they might kill you. Then there are all those engineers [scientists too] are they lying about their bridges, vehicles, machines? Science covers every aspect of human lives, why should one branch be staffed with crooks while the rest are respected? Full of holes old man, full of holes.

Just because a scientist has letters after his name and a bunch of publications produced, does not mean anything about whether he is right or wrong on any subject.
Climatology has just ust about the most variables in it than any other science, and therfore more prone to error and quite large ones at that.
I have letters after my name and quite a few publications to my repertoir mostly in IT, but taht does not I would be right on everything in IT.
The difference is these climate chappies think they are right always, and we know they have been proved wrong many a time.
Who collates all their stuff? Thats where the money is made. Oxford Unversity gets kudos and research grants and foreign student grants in spades. Therefore it is not just pure science or even accurate.
We must never take anything at face value, we should take time to read, research and judge for ourselves, not just slavishly follow the fashionable cause celebre.

I'm not following anyone, I have been living a low carbon, reduced impact lifestyle for over three decades. It is I and people like me who have made the subject centre stage and worthy of scientific study. The science is home and dry, done and dusted, no room for doubt. Obviously you haven't taken my advice and visited http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php for some facts, but prefer to deal in innuendo and vague accusations.
I should correct one statement I made, 2009 wasn't the hottest year on record... that was 2005, 2009 is a close second. The last decade was the hottest decade since records began. I am old enough to remember when winters were winters and summers were summers; now winter can have heat waves and summers hailstorms, even the plants know something is up as they are starting off three to four weeks early as anyone connected to the land knows and has commented on. The animals all know its happening also, species are moving north to keep their environment what they are used to. Soon there will be nowhere for them to go. How come you haven't noticed anything? We are making other species extinct at an increasing rate. Coral is dying all over the planet as it can't tolerate small differences in temperature. How come you still think your little insults - 'these climate chappies think they are right always, and we know they have been proved wrong many a time' of really? Let's have a few istances when 'these climate chappies' have been proved wrong. One then? No, thought not. And don't start about the UEA emails, clearly to anyone who's read them [and I, unlike most denialistas have done] they contain nothing more than irritation with the morons who constantly make their lives difficult with stupid pestering over freedom of information act demands, I can understand their irritation. Much as one feels towards a fly that just won't go away but keeps buzzing round your head.
You have come up with nothing concrete, just more buzzing.

You are being led by the nose by these climate fellas.
We had the Thames frozen over in the 1800's and warm winters as well.
Our ancesters hunting mammoths had to contend with at least one ice age, which was followed by a warm period and now we are in another one. Little or nothing we do currently can stop another ice age (this was all the rage a while back).
Pick a fad - someone will start it.
Perhaps the last ice age was forecast - no, the next one - not by the climate change people who are supposed to be paid to do so.
Last word - what do you know about the corals? I am a scuba diver with many years experience and I can assure you that far more damage is caused to the reefs by careless boat captains and scuba divers not paying attention to where their fins are when observing these precious resources.
Don't assume that I do not care about the environment, I notice far more than you are giving me credit for. It is just that I do not slavishly follow others when making decisions about my life.
I will not be dicated to by anybody, especially one with a totally closed mind such as yours.

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